1 00:00:11,770 --> 00:00:09,280 now hello everybody welcome to this 2 00:00:13,120 --> 00:00:11,780 Google Plus hangout I'm Karen Fox with 3 00:00:15,999 --> 00:00:13,130 the Office of Communications at NASA 4 00:00:17,409 --> 00:00:16,009 Goddard and for the next hour we're 5 00:00:20,140 --> 00:00:17,419 going to be discussing the recent 6 00:00:22,810 --> 00:00:20,150 discovery of the third radiation belt 7 00:00:25,659 --> 00:00:22,820 surrounding Earth the radiation belts 8 00:00:27,490 --> 00:00:25,669 are officially known as the Van Allen 9 00:00:31,959 --> 00:00:27,500 belts and they were the first discovery 10 00:00:36,100 --> 00:00:31,969 of the space age in 1958 in August of 11 00:00:38,229 --> 00:00:36,110 2012 NASA launched two spacecraft called 12 00:00:40,270 --> 00:00:38,239 the Van Allen probes to examine the 13 00:00:43,419 --> 00:00:40,280 belts in the best detail that we'd ever 14 00:00:45,459 --> 00:00:43,429 seen and within days of launch they had 15 00:00:48,430 --> 00:00:45,469 gathered information that really could 16 00:00:51,639 --> 00:00:48,440 be rewriting textbooks instead expected 17 00:00:54,220 --> 00:00:51,649 two belts they watched a third belt form 18 00:00:55,689 --> 00:00:54,230 and persist for a full month the 19 00:00:58,119 --> 00:00:55,699 discovery was published in science 20 00:01:00,759 --> 00:00:58,129 magazine yesterday and today we have 21 00:01:02,860 --> 00:01:00,769 five people talk about it we have David 22 00:01:05,710 --> 00:01:02,870 Tsai back who is the project scientist 23 00:01:07,899 --> 00:01:05,720 for the Van Allen probes Shree conical 24 00:01:10,030 --> 00:01:07,909 who is the deputy project scientist and 25 00:01:10,690 --> 00:01:10,040 one of the authors on the paper another 26 00:01:15,790 --> 00:01:10,700 on the paper 27 00:01:20,560 --> 00:01:15,800 us Sasha mikorski of the Johns Hopkins 28 00:01:23,050 --> 00:01:20,570 Applied Physics lab Alex Young is with 29 00:01:24,850 --> 00:01:23,060 us he's a scientist at NASA Goddard who 30 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:24,860 will speak about how the radiation belts 31 00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:26,210 are part of a larger space weather 32 00:01:32,620 --> 00:01:29,690 system and finally we have Washington 33 00:01:34,890 --> 00:01:32,630 Post reporter Brian Vostok who covers 34 00:01:37,270 --> 00:01:34,900 science and space weather for the paper 35 00:01:39,010 --> 00:01:37,280 Brian will be helping to facilitate the 36 00:01:42,310 --> 00:01:39,020 conversation today so I'm going to turn 37 00:01:43,570 --> 00:01:42,320 it over to him in just a moment later on 38 00:01:46,480 --> 00:01:43,580 in the conversation we will be answering 39 00:01:49,390 --> 00:01:46,490 your questions you may send them in via 40 00:01:53,380 --> 00:01:49,400 via the Google hangout or Beyer the 41 00:01:59,080 --> 00:01:53,390 Twitter hashtag Van Allen that is the a 42 00:02:01,540 --> 00:01:59,090 and a llen and with that let's go to 43 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:01,550 Brian thanks Karen 44 00:02:06,790 --> 00:02:03,610 happy to be here with everybody today 45 00:02:08,020 --> 00:02:06,800 excited to do this I wrote a story that 46 00:02:09,869 --> 00:02:08,030 was in today's Washington Post about 47 00:02:12,070 --> 00:02:09,879 this discovery it caught my attention 48 00:02:15,399 --> 00:02:12,080 because as you said we've known about 49 00:02:16,790 --> 00:02:15,409 these radiation belts for since 1958 I 50 00:02:18,380 --> 00:02:16,800 guess 51 00:02:19,520 --> 00:02:18,390 yet it seems like they're still kind of 52 00:02:22,100 --> 00:02:19,530 mysterious and we're learning all kinds 53 00:02:24,470 --> 00:02:22,110 of new things so I'm hoping that David 54 00:02:26,360 --> 00:02:24,480 we can start with you and you can just 55 00:02:28,430 --> 00:02:26,370 give us some background on the Van Allen 56 00:02:31,340 --> 00:02:28,440 radiation belts why they're important 57 00:02:31,820 --> 00:02:31,350 and kind of what they are okay Thank You 58 00:02:34,370 --> 00:02:31,830 Bryan 59 00:02:36,710 --> 00:02:34,380 as you mentioned we've known about the 60 00:02:39,920 --> 00:02:36,720 Van Allen radiation belts existed only 61 00:02:42,470 --> 00:02:39,930 since the late 1950s when dr. James Van 62 00:02:45,020 --> 00:02:42,480 Allen launched a series of rockets up 63 00:02:47,150 --> 00:02:45,030 into the Earth's upper atmosphere the 64 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:47,160 surprising discovery he made was that 65 00:02:53,300 --> 00:02:50,850 space is radioactive those early rockets 66 00:02:55,820 --> 00:02:53,310 carried Geiger counters capable of 67 00:02:57,290 --> 00:02:55,830 measuring radiation in space as time 68 00:02:59,630 --> 00:02:57,300 went on we've realized they're quite 69 00:03:02,540 --> 00:02:59,640 extensive the Van Allen radiation belts 70 00:03:04,850 --> 00:03:02,550 cover several Earth radii from Earth and 71 00:03:07,100 --> 00:03:04,860 we've always thought until now that 72 00:03:10,280 --> 00:03:07,110 there were two of them one close to 73 00:03:12,620 --> 00:03:10,290 Earth about several several hundred 74 00:03:15,830 --> 00:03:12,630 miles above the Earth's surface and a 75 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:15,840 second one further out tens of thousands 76 00:03:20,690 --> 00:03:18,450 of miles above the Earth's surface they 77 00:03:23,690 --> 00:03:20,700 pose a hazard to our spacecraft and they 78 00:03:26,570 --> 00:03:23,700 pose a hazard to our astronauts because 79 00:03:29,270 --> 00:03:26,580 radiation in space can cause cancer 80 00:03:32,090 --> 00:03:29,280 prolonged exposure and radiation in 81 00:03:35,060 --> 00:03:32,100 space can disrupt electronic circuits on 82 00:03:37,400 --> 00:03:35,070 spacecraft can cars charging up and 83 00:03:39,770 --> 00:03:37,410 discharging on the spacecraft they can 84 00:03:42,740 --> 00:03:39,780 simply ruin the spacecraft that we rely 85 00:03:44,780 --> 00:03:42,750 on what do we rely on the Oh question uh 86 00:03:46,490 --> 00:03:44,790 I was I'm sorry to interrupt you so soon 87 00:03:48,830 --> 00:03:46,500 but I was just wondering if you could 88 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:48,840 just tell us how big of a discovery was 89 00:03:54,440 --> 00:03:51,690 this in 1958 was it a major deal at the 90 00:03:56,900 --> 00:03:54,450 time this was a major deal is put Van 91 00:03:59,570 --> 00:03:56,910 Alen on the cover of Time magazine and 92 00:04:01,190 --> 00:03:59,580 this spurred the part was part of the 93 00:04:03,530 --> 00:04:01,200 reason that spurred the u.s. space 94 00:04:05,180 --> 00:04:03,540 program NASA's program because we 95 00:04:07,670 --> 00:04:05,190 suddenly realized space wasn't empty 96 00:04:09,650 --> 00:04:07,680 there was a lot going on there and not 97 00:04:12,050 --> 00:04:09,660 only that the things that were going on 98 00:04:14,330 --> 00:04:12,060 there were hazardous they could disrupt 99 00:04:17,180 --> 00:04:14,340 our communication spacecraft they could 100 00:04:19,670 --> 00:04:17,190 disrupt our weather spacecraft things 101 00:04:22,390 --> 00:04:19,680 that we rely on every day that these 102 00:04:26,360 --> 00:04:22,400 spacecraft fly in the radiation belts 103 00:04:29,300 --> 00:04:26,370 right right in vain yet these belts have 104 00:04:30,740 --> 00:04:29,310 not been fully explored apparently right 105 00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:30,750 that's right 106 00:04:34,010 --> 00:04:32,490 a series of spacecraft have been there 107 00:04:36,530 --> 00:04:34,020 but they haven't been fully instrumented 108 00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:36,540 there's never been two identical 109 00:04:40,850 --> 00:04:38,330 spacecraft there at the same time 110 00:04:43,010 --> 00:04:40,860 capable of making the multi point 111 00:04:44,960 --> 00:04:43,020 measurements that we need to have to 112 00:04:47,180 --> 00:04:44,970 understand what's going on so we found a 113 00:04:49,280 --> 00:04:47,190 fragmentary knowledge we've had to put 114 00:04:52,130 --> 00:04:49,290 pieces together we've had to make 115 00:04:53,990 --> 00:04:52,140 guesses we'd had to make assumptions but 116 00:04:56,690 --> 00:04:54,000 now for the first time we've got two 117 00:04:59,150 --> 00:04:56,700 identical fully equipped spacecraft 118 00:05:01,340 --> 00:04:59,160 going in and out through the radiation 119 00:05:03,410 --> 00:05:01,350 belt several times per day to give us 120 00:05:05,750 --> 00:05:03,420 the picture we really need to understand 121 00:05:07,370 --> 00:05:05,760 what's going on right and now I think 122 00:05:10,490 --> 00:05:07,380 this is a good time to bring shriti into 123 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:10,500 the conversation here and tell us about 124 00:05:14,600 --> 00:05:12,690 this discovery what fascinated me about 125 00:05:16,670 --> 00:05:14,610 this discovery is how serendipitous it 126 00:05:17,990 --> 00:05:16,680 was you know the annals of science are 127 00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:18,000 just filled with serendipitous 128 00:05:22,910 --> 00:05:20,490 discoveries but you guys you launch 129 00:05:25,370 --> 00:05:22,920 these probes last August and you decided 130 00:05:27,100 --> 00:05:25,380 to turn on your radiation detector about 131 00:05:28,580 --> 00:05:27,110 a month ahead of time is that right 132 00:05:29,890 --> 00:05:28,590 that's right 133 00:05:33,890 --> 00:05:29,900 you know there was another spacecraft 134 00:05:36,410 --> 00:05:33,900 called Sam tax which was orbiting in 135 00:05:38,840 --> 00:05:36,420 low-earth and we wanted it was just 136 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:38,850 about to re-enter the atmosphere and we 137 00:05:45,620 --> 00:05:41,730 wanted to have overlap so that we could 138 00:05:48,440 --> 00:05:45,630 enhance the science return from Van 139 00:05:51,500 --> 00:05:48,450 Allen probes so we decided to turn on 140 00:05:54,230 --> 00:05:51,510 our instrument reps for relativistic 141 00:05:57,980 --> 00:05:54,240 electron proton Telescope which measures 142 00:06:00,740 --> 00:05:57,990 high-energy electrons whole month ahead 143 00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:00,750 of what we had planned just in order to 144 00:06:08,420 --> 00:06:04,170 overlap with the Sam pak spacecraft and 145 00:06:12,050 --> 00:06:08,430 to our surprise we found this third 146 00:06:14,330 --> 00:06:12,060 radiation belt and we were completely 147 00:06:17,630 --> 00:06:14,340 taken aback by it we were not expecting 148 00:06:21,620 --> 00:06:17,640 it at all and in the beginning we 149 00:06:23,330 --> 00:06:21,630 thought oh maybe there is a mistake in 150 00:06:26,180 --> 00:06:23,340 our instrument maybe something is wrong 151 00:06:29,050 --> 00:06:26,190 with it and as days went by we became 152 00:06:32,510 --> 00:06:29,060 more and more certain that indeed it was 153 00:06:38,060 --> 00:06:32,520 nothing wrong with our instrument Nature 154 00:06:41,660 --> 00:06:38,070 was giving us a spectacular show so it 155 00:06:43,129 --> 00:06:41,670 was a very serendipitous one I guess 156 00:06:44,420 --> 00:06:43,139 somebody famous 157 00:06:46,219 --> 00:06:44,430 said that you know scientific 158 00:06:48,890 --> 00:06:46,229 discoveries often start not with Eureka 159 00:06:50,300 --> 00:06:48,900 but with hey that's funny I guess you 160 00:06:52,309 --> 00:06:50,310 have one of those hey that's funny 161 00:06:53,300 --> 00:06:52,319 moments right absolutely I mean you know 162 00:06:55,820 --> 00:06:53,310 you suck 163 00:06:58,580 --> 00:06:55,830 wow this this looks strange this looks 164 00:07:01,760 --> 00:06:58,590 via this looks bizarre it can't really 165 00:07:03,969 --> 00:07:01,770 possibly be true but then you know as we 166 00:07:07,489 --> 00:07:03,979 look more and more at our data we 167 00:07:09,619 --> 00:07:07,499 realized yes it's true oh boy this is 168 00:07:12,260 --> 00:07:09,629 something really new it was very 169 00:07:15,200 --> 00:07:12,270 exciting for us and in this third band 170 00:07:17,540 --> 00:07:15,210 of radiation it was temporary right tell 171 00:07:22,490 --> 00:07:17,550 me about you know how you followed it in 172 00:07:25,610 --> 00:07:22,500 in how long it lasted so the third band 173 00:07:28,790 --> 00:07:25,620 or the storage ring or the radiation 174 00:07:32,510 --> 00:07:28,800 belts lasted for about four to four 175 00:07:36,050 --> 00:07:32,520 weeks I believe it started off from a 176 00:07:37,939 --> 00:07:36,060 prior electron energization event which 177 00:07:41,149 --> 00:07:37,949 we call when the electron fluxes 178 00:07:41,600 --> 00:07:41,159 increase and that comes from the CERN 179 00:07:45,010 --> 00:07:41,610 right 180 00:07:48,499 --> 00:07:45,020 that's a solar event yes the the solar 181 00:07:52,369 --> 00:07:48,509 solar event actually produces changes 182 00:07:55,369 --> 00:07:52,379 inside the magnetosphere which make 183 00:07:57,439 --> 00:07:55,379 these belts get pumped up so when these 184 00:08:01,429 --> 00:07:57,449 belts get pumped up the number of 185 00:08:05,779 --> 00:08:01,439 particles in it get energized they also 186 00:08:08,839 --> 00:08:05,789 increase in not in sheer number so this 187 00:08:11,329 --> 00:08:08,849 this is the radiation hazard that David 188 00:08:13,790 --> 00:08:11,339 was referring to just a while ago and 189 00:08:16,820 --> 00:08:13,800 when this event happened after his 190 00:08:20,059 --> 00:08:16,830 events then there was another event 191 00:08:22,550 --> 00:08:20,069 which emptied the outer belt but it 192 00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:22,560 obviously didn't empty the whole outer 193 00:08:27,139 --> 00:08:23,810 belt there was an inner 194 00:08:31,070 --> 00:08:27,149 sliver of the outer belt left however 195 00:08:34,399 --> 00:08:31,080 then the energization occurred and the 196 00:08:35,899 --> 00:08:34,409 second belt came back on and at this 197 00:08:38,659 --> 00:08:35,909 point it would it should have had all 198 00:08:42,439 --> 00:08:38,669 become like one single entity it did not 199 00:08:46,910 --> 00:08:42,449 the sliver continued to last so we have 200 00:08:50,319 --> 00:08:46,920 a three radiation belt structure lasting 201 00:08:52,809 --> 00:08:50,329 for more than a month right right and 202 00:08:55,950 --> 00:08:52,819 David can you maybe explain a little bit 203 00:08:58,630 --> 00:08:55,960 what why this was so 204 00:09:00,340 --> 00:08:58,640 unexpected to see to see this happen are 205 00:09:01,420 --> 00:09:00,350 you a good person to explain that I can 206 00:09:03,730 --> 00:09:01,430 give it a go 207 00:09:06,490 --> 00:09:03,740 we try to model the Earth's radiation 208 00:09:08,830 --> 00:09:06,500 belts we use our most complex computer 209 00:09:12,220 --> 00:09:08,840 simulations to know what's going on and 210 00:09:15,010 --> 00:09:12,230 no computer simulation no model has ever 211 00:09:18,010 --> 00:09:15,020 predicted three radiation belts - yes 212 00:09:20,950 --> 00:09:18,020 three no and a third one that comes and 213 00:09:22,900 --> 00:09:20,960 goes isn't there is there things get 214 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:22,910 swept up things come back on these 215 00:09:27,460 --> 00:09:25,370 timescales in this way never happen 216 00:09:29,410 --> 00:09:27,470 before so we have something fundamental 217 00:09:32,260 --> 00:09:29,420 here that we need to try to understand 218 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:32,270 so the physicist the plasma physicist 219 00:09:36,670 --> 00:09:34,010 and Helio physicists have to go back to 220 00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:36,680 work to try to figure out the physics of 221 00:09:43,690 --> 00:09:38,810 this phenomena right not back to the 222 00:09:46,300 --> 00:09:43,700 drawing board right well Alex maybe you 223 00:09:48,910 --> 00:09:46,310 can broaden out this conversation a 224 00:09:51,070 --> 00:09:48,920 little bit to talk about it how you know 225 00:09:52,990 --> 00:09:51,080 space weather is this term for you know 226 00:09:54,610 --> 00:09:53,000 what's happening with the Sun the 227 00:09:57,400 --> 00:09:54,620 energetic particles that are being shot 228 00:10:00,310 --> 00:09:57,410 out into space and I guess the Van Allen 229 00:10:01,510 --> 00:10:00,320 belts are kind of a reflection of the 230 00:10:03,580 --> 00:10:01,520 immediate space weather environment 231 00:10:07,830 --> 00:10:03,590 around Earth could you explain that a 232 00:10:10,330 --> 00:10:07,840 little bit well yes so the there is this 233 00:10:12,790 --> 00:10:10,340 constant stream of energy coming away 234 00:10:15,130 --> 00:10:12,800 from the Sun in the form of particles we 235 00:10:18,730 --> 00:10:15,140 call the solar wind but then 236 00:10:21,490 --> 00:10:18,740 occasionally the Sun spits out something 237 00:10:23,440 --> 00:10:21,500 in addition corrupt we call it a coronal 238 00:10:26,110 --> 00:10:23,450 mass ejection it's just a big blob of 239 00:10:28,570 --> 00:10:26,120 solar plasma that's threaded with 240 00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:28,580 magnetic field and this thing comes 241 00:10:34,330 --> 00:10:31,610 along and rides on the solar wind almost 242 00:10:37,660 --> 00:10:34,340 like a surfer and adds this extra punch 243 00:10:40,870 --> 00:10:37,670 and this all of this stuff comes along 244 00:10:45,430 --> 00:10:40,880 and if it's directed towards Earth it 245 00:10:47,350 --> 00:10:45,440 hits our magnetosphere and all of this 246 00:10:48,970 --> 00:10:47,360 energy and all these particles interact 247 00:10:51,820 --> 00:10:48,980 with it and this is an incredibly 248 00:10:53,560 --> 00:10:51,830 dynamic system and so one of the things 249 00:10:55,870 --> 00:10:53,570 that's the most exciting about the 250 00:10:58,360 --> 00:10:55,880 radiation bounces this is this is a 251 00:11:02,520 --> 00:10:58,370 result of this dynamic phenomenon of 252 00:11:06,340 --> 00:11:02,530 this injection of stuff of energy into 253 00:11:09,519 --> 00:11:06,350 our local environment and the problem 254 00:11:11,199 --> 00:11:09,529 we've always had in science is is the 255 00:11:13,179 --> 00:11:11,209 dynamics is always the difficult thing 256 00:11:17,170 --> 00:11:13,189 to understand it's always the thing 257 00:11:19,210 --> 00:11:17,180 that's hardest to model and this is an 258 00:11:22,989 --> 00:11:19,220 example where we have this incredibly 259 00:11:28,090 --> 00:11:22,999 dynamic transient structure and it's 260 00:11:31,389 --> 00:11:28,100 giving us a direct look at the complex 261 00:11:33,309 --> 00:11:31,399 physics that's going on and showing us 262 00:11:35,980 --> 00:11:33,319 the kinds of things that we really have 263 00:11:39,509 --> 00:11:35,990 to be able to understand because this 264 00:11:42,249 --> 00:11:39,519 whole system the space weather system is 265 00:11:44,530 --> 00:11:42,259 connected from the surface well actually 266 00:11:46,809 --> 00:11:44,540 from the inside of the Sun out to the 267 00:11:49,269 --> 00:11:46,819 surface all the way through the 268 00:11:51,249 --> 00:11:49,279 interplanetary medium to the earth so 269 00:11:54,249 --> 00:11:51,259 and this happens through the entire 270 00:11:57,100 --> 00:11:54,259 solar system so really we're living 271 00:11:59,230 --> 00:11:57,110 inside the the atmosphere of the star 272 00:12:01,030 --> 00:11:59,240 the entire solar system is inside this 273 00:12:03,579 --> 00:12:01,040 Apple we're inside the bubble all the 274 00:12:05,739 --> 00:12:03,589 time exactly and so the inner the inner 275 00:12:07,030 --> 00:12:05,749 mantle and ring is pretty stable that's 276 00:12:08,410 --> 00:12:07,040 what Shree told me yesterday when I 277 00:12:11,799 --> 00:12:08,420 interviewed him but this outer ring is 278 00:12:13,480 --> 00:12:11,809 this kind of roiling dynamic changing 279 00:12:14,470 --> 00:12:13,490 structure right it's a shriek can you 280 00:12:16,240 --> 00:12:14,480 explain that a little bit it's 281 00:12:20,559 --> 00:12:16,250 constantly expanding and contracting 282 00:12:24,759 --> 00:12:20,569 that kind of thing yes the outer Bell is 283 00:12:29,019 --> 00:12:24,769 made up mainly of particles very light 284 00:12:32,590 --> 00:12:29,029 particles called electrons which wax and 285 00:12:34,600 --> 00:12:32,600 wane in response to the solar inputs 286 00:12:37,090 --> 00:12:34,610 that Alex was just talking about coronal 287 00:12:39,670 --> 00:12:37,100 mass ejections there are other things 288 00:12:41,740 --> 00:12:39,680 called high speed streams when they 289 00:12:44,980 --> 00:12:41,750 impact the magnetosphere they compress 290 00:12:47,290 --> 00:12:44,990 the magnetosphere they create plasma 291 00:12:51,429 --> 00:12:47,300 waves they create other kinds of 292 00:12:54,819 --> 00:12:51,439 disturbances and they will actually act 293 00:12:58,869 --> 00:12:54,829 on the existing electron populations to 294 00:13:02,110 --> 00:12:58,879 pump them up to deplete them sometimes 295 00:13:04,030 --> 00:13:02,120 no change which is what makes prediction 296 00:13:06,759 --> 00:13:04,040 and understanding of these populations 297 00:13:09,549 --> 00:13:06,769 very difficult because there are 298 00:13:11,499 --> 00:13:09,559 multiple processes going on processes 299 00:13:13,739 --> 00:13:11,509 that will increase the number of 300 00:13:16,799 --> 00:13:13,749 electrons which we call energization 301 00:13:18,790 --> 00:13:16,809 processes that will deplete the 302 00:13:22,090 --> 00:13:18,800 radiation belts which we call loss 303 00:13:23,350 --> 00:13:22,100 processes and these two processes 304 00:13:26,500 --> 00:13:23,360 compete with each other 305 00:13:29,530 --> 00:13:26,510 to result in the net amount of electrons 306 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:29,540 we see so if there is more energization 307 00:13:34,620 --> 00:13:31,490 if more particles are energized then you 308 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:34,630 see an increased number of particles ie 309 00:13:42,280 --> 00:13:38,290 particle intensity goes up the loss is 310 00:13:46,030 --> 00:13:42,290 dominant then particle intensity goes 311 00:13:48,519 --> 00:13:46,040 down and the trick is the challenge is 312 00:13:50,829 --> 00:13:48,529 to figure out what happens in a 313 00:13:53,290 --> 00:13:50,839 particular event and to what extent 314 00:13:55,360 --> 00:13:53,300 right right and I think Sasha has been 315 00:13:57,389 --> 00:13:55,370 waiting patiently here and I think he 316 00:14:00,040 --> 00:13:57,399 can show us a little bit about a 317 00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:00,050 visualization of the three rings is that 318 00:14:04,750 --> 00:14:01,730 right do you have an image you can show 319 00:14:09,460 --> 00:14:04,760 us that is possible I can try and share 320 00:14:10,180 --> 00:14:09,470 it like you know if if it works just one 321 00:14:19,110 --> 00:14:10,190 second 322 00:14:25,300 --> 00:14:19,120 Oh screen share and I hit the movie and 323 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:25,310 can you see it well I'm not sure if we 324 00:14:29,259 --> 00:14:27,170 can but maybe you could at least 325 00:14:31,060 --> 00:14:29,269 describe the visualization techniques 326 00:14:32,199 --> 00:14:31,070 how you how you take the data I can see 327 00:14:40,980 --> 00:14:32,209 it in the thumbnails I don't know if the 328 00:14:44,579 --> 00:14:40,990 audience can see oh that is too bad so 329 00:14:47,590 --> 00:14:44,589 even if I speak there's no visual 330 00:14:49,660 --> 00:14:47,600 accompanying so I should try the screen 331 00:14:56,949 --> 00:14:49,670 share while you're talking it should I 332 00:14:59,470 --> 00:14:56,959 would think to test the technology and 333 00:15:01,060 --> 00:14:59,480 also Karl has turned it on the thumbnail 334 00:15:03,280 --> 00:15:01,070 anyone who's watching can click on that 335 00:15:05,860 --> 00:15:03,290 thumbnail in the bottom and it will open 336 00:15:08,019 --> 00:15:05,870 up for everyone to view and while sasha 337 00:15:11,170 --> 00:15:08,029 is looking through the screen share on 338 00:15:12,550 --> 00:15:11,180 his let me remind everybody that anyone 339 00:15:14,860 --> 00:15:12,560 who's just joined us recently we're 340 00:15:18,069 --> 00:15:14,870 talking today about the Van Allen probes 341 00:15:20,319 --> 00:15:18,079 and the recent discovery of a third 342 00:15:21,670 --> 00:15:20,329 radiation belt we will be taking 343 00:15:22,870 --> 00:15:21,680 questions over the course of the hour 344 00:15:25,420 --> 00:15:22,880 we'll be answering them a little bit 345 00:15:27,759 --> 00:15:25,430 later you may send your questions either 346 00:15:31,290 --> 00:15:27,769 via the Google hangout or using the 347 00:15:32,990 --> 00:15:31,300 Twitter hashtag Van Allen which is VA na 348 00:15:34,910 --> 00:15:33,000 llen 349 00:15:39,100 --> 00:15:34,920 thanks and I'll hand it back to Sasha 350 00:15:41,390 --> 00:15:39,110 and Brian all right okay so I'm hitting 351 00:15:43,970 --> 00:15:41,400 screenshare yeah all right no no I can 352 00:15:47,270 --> 00:15:43,980 see oh that's is great so basically 353 00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:47,280 before I hit the play button let me talk 354 00:15:51,860 --> 00:15:49,890 you know what we're looking at obviously 355 00:15:54,860 --> 00:15:51,870 there is a star background but these 356 00:15:58,070 --> 00:15:54,870 white lines that we're looking at this 357 00:16:00,200 --> 00:15:58,080 is a schematic representation of the 358 00:16:03,110 --> 00:16:00,210 magnetic field that actually controls 359 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:03,120 the behavior of these high-energy 360 00:16:11,930 --> 00:16:07,770 particles that the radiation belts are 361 00:16:16,280 --> 00:16:11,940 consists of and you can see this stable 362 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:16,290 inner belt which will not maybe be as 363 00:16:23,870 --> 00:16:21,450 stable during this simulation or 364 00:16:26,630 --> 00:16:23,880 animation that I am showing for reasons 365 00:16:29,750 --> 00:16:26,640 that I can go into but more importantly 366 00:16:34,190 --> 00:16:29,760 you are looking at the slaughter region 367 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:34,200 and this second belt which actually is 368 00:16:41,590 --> 00:16:38,250 not the full second belt but but the 369 00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:41,600 storage ring that you guys introduced 370 00:16:48,380 --> 00:16:45,930 earlier and this animation starts and 371 00:16:53,750 --> 00:16:48,390 I'm going to hit the play button right 372 00:16:56,870 --> 00:16:53,760 after one of these systems from the Sun 373 00:17:01,430 --> 00:16:56,880 came and destroyed the outer portion of 374 00:17:05,390 --> 00:17:01,440 the outer belt and just left the storage 375 00:17:07,130 --> 00:17:05,400 ring sitting there and storage ring it 376 00:17:09,740 --> 00:17:07,140 is I we should tell people is lingo for 377 00:17:13,939 --> 00:17:09,750 the the third belt right that that is 378 00:17:16,520 --> 00:17:13,949 correct and the color in this animation 379 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:16,530 basically represents the intensity of 380 00:17:21,770 --> 00:17:19,170 radiation in the belt the brighter the 381 00:17:24,170 --> 00:17:21,780 color the more red the colors are it 382 00:17:28,490 --> 00:17:24,180 means that the more intense radiation 383 00:17:32,600 --> 00:17:28,500 levels are in this specific place in the 384 00:17:36,380 --> 00:17:32,610 belt is this animation showing actual 385 00:17:38,330 --> 00:17:36,390 data from the probes from basically that 386 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:38,340 that is correct so basically under the 387 00:17:45,190 --> 00:17:41,490 hood of this animation what we have is 388 00:17:46,919 --> 00:17:45,200 very sophisticated test particle 389 00:17:49,980 --> 00:17:46,929 physical model 390 00:17:51,930 --> 00:17:49,990 simulation model of dynamics of 391 00:17:55,320 --> 00:17:51,940 radiation belt particles that we've been 392 00:17:58,320 --> 00:17:55,330 developing at APL for a long time but 393 00:18:00,869 --> 00:17:58,330 it's driven what is more importantly a 394 00:18:03,989 --> 00:18:00,879 bit more important is driven by real 395 00:18:07,769 --> 00:18:03,999 data coming from Van Allen probes right 396 00:18:10,619 --> 00:18:07,779 that accurately shows us the spatial and 397 00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:10,629 temporal variations of radiation across 398 00:18:15,359 --> 00:18:13,090 the belt right so what we're seeing here 399 00:18:17,369 --> 00:18:15,369 is basically a cutaway view of two 400 00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:17,379 toroid Zoar two doughnuts that go all 401 00:18:20,639 --> 00:18:18,610 the way around the earth right this is 402 00:18:23,310 --> 00:18:20,649 like a sliced view yes that is correct 403 00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:23,320 so on your left this is where the Sun is 404 00:18:29,789 --> 00:18:27,129 and the opposite direction from the Sun 405 00:18:32,369 --> 00:18:29,799 is to the right and you are looking at 406 00:18:35,399 --> 00:18:32,379 this 2-dimensional cut the plane that 407 00:18:37,799 --> 00:18:35,409 cuts radiation belts in half and you can 408 00:18:40,169 --> 00:18:37,809 see this you know like you saw with me 409 00:18:43,859 --> 00:18:40,179 around the animation again that these 410 00:18:47,909 --> 00:18:43,869 white lines that represent the magnetic 411 00:18:49,830 --> 00:18:47,919 field they they kind of vibrate and this 412 00:18:53,399 --> 00:18:49,840 is because they directly respond to 413 00:18:56,100 --> 00:18:53,409 activity that is driven by the Sun and 414 00:18:57,869 --> 00:18:56,110 this is why you have difference on the 415 00:19:01,680 --> 00:18:57,879 levels left hand side and right hand 416 00:19:05,369 --> 00:19:01,690 side and this is what is affecting the 417 00:19:07,950 --> 00:19:05,379 dynamics of these particles that are 418 00:19:09,269 --> 00:19:07,960 forming radiation belts right well thank 419 00:19:10,619 --> 00:19:09,279 you for showing us that it's very cool 420 00:19:13,129 --> 00:19:10,629 animation and I think it helps people 421 00:19:16,669 --> 00:19:13,139 obviously visualize what's going on 422 00:19:19,109 --> 00:19:16,679 David can you tell us a little bit about 423 00:19:21,419 --> 00:19:19,119 you know or maybe this is a question for 424 00:19:23,340 --> 00:19:21,429 Alex you know I mentioned satellites 425 00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:23,350 being affected by these radiation belts 426 00:19:27,119 --> 00:19:25,210 I mean how serious of a threat are they 427 00:19:30,659 --> 00:19:27,129 to communication and weather satellites 428 00:19:32,129 --> 00:19:30,669 do they have to you know turn off 429 00:19:33,539 --> 00:19:32,139 instruments when they fly through these 430 00:19:35,930 --> 00:19:33,549 belts do they have to take other 431 00:19:39,090 --> 00:19:35,940 countermeasures to protect themselves 432 00:19:41,100 --> 00:19:39,100 that's certainly a possibility one thing 433 00:19:43,529 --> 00:19:41,110 the principal thing is they should be 434 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:43,539 designed with thick enough shielding to 435 00:19:46,830 --> 00:19:45,610 protect the electronics within the 436 00:19:48,869 --> 00:19:46,840 instruments but the thick of their 437 00:19:50,909 --> 00:19:48,879 shielding the greater the mass of the 438 00:19:53,129 --> 00:19:50,919 spacecraft the heavier it is and the 439 00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:53,139 more it takes to launch it into space so 440 00:19:56,849 --> 00:19:54,730 we'd like to know what's the minimum 441 00:19:59,999 --> 00:19:56,859 requirement that will cut costs for 442 00:20:00,750 --> 00:20:00,009 spacecraft then second these are these 443 00:20:03,030 --> 00:20:00,760 effects are 444 00:20:05,940 --> 00:20:03,040 to knock out an entire spacecraft and 445 00:20:07,740 --> 00:20:05,950 ruin it so we have to have the knowledge 446 00:20:10,350 --> 00:20:07,750 of when and where these type of events 447 00:20:12,300 --> 00:20:10,360 will occur and third as you just said 448 00:20:15,120 --> 00:20:12,310 there are some spacecraft that carry 449 00:20:17,070 --> 00:20:15,130 instruments so sensitive that they would 450 00:20:19,260 --> 00:20:17,080 be ruined by these effects and those 451 00:20:21,990 --> 00:20:19,270 instruments have to turn off during a 452 00:20:25,590 --> 00:20:22,000 storm like this right right 453 00:20:26,670 --> 00:20:25,600 Alex says has there been a case or let 454 00:20:29,010 --> 00:20:26,680 me ask all of you has there ever been a 455 00:20:31,350 --> 00:20:29,020 case of a satellite being damaged or 456 00:20:36,060 --> 00:20:31,360 rendered inoperable by the radiation 457 00:20:38,700 --> 00:20:36,070 bills well I mean it's certainly the 458 00:20:43,340 --> 00:20:38,710 case that that satellites have been 459 00:20:47,400 --> 00:20:43,350 damaged and some critically damaged by 460 00:20:48,870 --> 00:20:47,410 energetic electrons right let me let me 461 00:20:51,090 --> 00:20:48,880 jump in for a minute 462 00:20:53,370 --> 00:20:51,100 we know we expect that will be the 463 00:20:55,920 --> 00:20:53,380 ultimate fate of these Van Allen probes 464 00:20:58,530 --> 00:20:55,930 spacecraft prolonged exposure to the 465 00:21:01,050 --> 00:20:58,540 radiation belts will one day kill them 466 00:21:04,830 --> 00:21:01,060 there in a most hazardous possible place 467 00:21:08,330 --> 00:21:04,840 do you tell your question Brian yes I 468 00:21:15,030 --> 00:21:08,340 can I certainly remember one instance 469 00:21:18,270 --> 00:21:15,040 which affected society fairly moderately 470 00:21:23,010 --> 00:21:18,280 I would say this was a loss of a 471 00:21:28,140 --> 00:21:23,020 Canadian communication satellite called 472 00:21:31,650 --> 00:21:28,150 an ik a n I K and I believe the Canadian 473 00:21:34,170 --> 00:21:31,660 newspapers carried a headline that by 474 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:34,180 putting a P in front of it saying panic 475 00:21:41,790 --> 00:21:39,610 so it not of communications I cannot 476 00:21:45,390 --> 00:21:41,800 recall on the top of my head when 477 00:21:47,700 --> 00:21:45,400 exactly it was but I'm sure all the 478 00:21:49,890 --> 00:21:47,710 readers viewers on Google can 479 00:21:50,330 --> 00:21:49,900 immediately google Anik and they find 480 00:21:54,090 --> 00:21:50,340 out 481 00:21:58,610 --> 00:21:54,100 although the thing is it's difficult to 482 00:22:01,820 --> 00:21:58,620 associate to pinpoint the exact cause 483 00:22:04,590 --> 00:22:01,830 but the satellite died just when 484 00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:04,600 electron fluxes were very high so it's 485 00:22:10,530 --> 00:22:07,330 extremely likely that they will cause 486 00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:10,540 the failure so it's suspicious right and 487 00:22:13,380 --> 00:22:12,010 so that of course brings us back to the 488 00:22:14,310 --> 00:22:13,390 point that being able to predict the 489 00:22:16,769 --> 00:22:14,320 behavior of these 490 00:22:20,009 --> 00:22:16,779 is very important for commerce here on 491 00:22:23,460 --> 00:22:20,019 earth and I guess for astronauts too 492 00:22:25,649 --> 00:22:23,470 although the outer belt is beyond you 493 00:22:28,919 --> 00:22:25,659 know low-earth orbit but what are the 494 00:22:32,399 --> 00:22:28,929 risks to space travelers who wants to 495 00:22:35,120 --> 00:22:32,409 wants to answer that question I can take 496 00:22:37,169 --> 00:22:35,130 a crack at it if you are doing any 497 00:22:39,330 --> 00:22:37,179 interplanetary travel let's say for 498 00:22:40,799 --> 00:22:39,340 example you want to go to Mars so you 499 00:22:44,759 --> 00:22:40,809 would have to go through the radiation 500 00:22:48,269 --> 00:22:44,769 guns I mean the outer radiation when 501 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:48,279 you're doing that if in case of man 502 00:22:54,450 --> 00:22:51,730 flight it's fine if you are inside the 503 00:22:56,730 --> 00:22:54,460 spacecraft which is well shielded but if 504 00:23:00,440 --> 00:22:56,740 you are outside the spacecraft and where 505 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:00,450 for whatever purpose to do a EBA then 506 00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:04,330 you can be in serious danger because the 507 00:23:11,119 --> 00:23:06,250 only thing that separates you from space 508 00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:11,129 and radiation in it is a thin spacesuit 509 00:23:15,360 --> 00:23:13,570 in addition to that one has to wonder 510 00:23:17,909 --> 00:23:15,370 about the collective dose that 511 00:23:20,129 --> 00:23:17,919 accumulates as one travels through the 512 00:23:22,289 --> 00:23:20,139 radiation so in principle that could be 513 00:23:23,580 --> 00:23:22,299 a hazard right so you would want to 514 00:23:25,470 --> 00:23:23,590 touch you would want to time your space 515 00:23:28,019 --> 00:23:25,480 mission for when the belts are quiet 516 00:23:29,700 --> 00:23:28,029 right exactly if you can do that that's 517 00:23:31,529 --> 00:23:29,710 you know from the science point of view 518 00:23:34,230 --> 00:23:31,539 if we can understand the science enough 519 00:23:37,230 --> 00:23:34,240 to be able to predict when the most 520 00:23:42,269 --> 00:23:37,240 severe events will occur how long they 521 00:23:44,909 --> 00:23:42,279 will last and that will enable a safe 522 00:23:46,259 --> 00:23:44,919 passage for these astronauts right Alex 523 00:23:47,999 --> 00:23:46,269 it look like you wanted to jump in there 524 00:23:51,389 --> 00:23:48,009 yeah I just wanted to add something to 525 00:23:53,450 --> 00:23:51,399 what Shree said we were talking about 526 00:23:57,210 --> 00:23:53,460 energetic particles electrons protons 527 00:24:00,149 --> 00:23:57,220 that space travelers are exposed to it 528 00:24:04,470 --> 00:24:00,159 really is the the main concern is this 529 00:24:08,399 --> 00:24:04,480 long term dose astronauts have an 530 00:24:12,299 --> 00:24:08,409 allowed amount of radiations accumulated 531 00:24:14,730 --> 00:24:12,309 radiation over their their time as an 532 00:24:16,710 --> 00:24:14,740 astronaut and if an astronaut reaches 533 00:24:20,639 --> 00:24:16,720 that limit then that will be permanently 534 00:24:25,730 --> 00:24:20,649 grounded so so it is really critical to 535 00:24:27,850 --> 00:24:25,740 understand the this long term dosage 536 00:24:32,020 --> 00:24:27,860 that's that's a 537 00:24:36,220 --> 00:24:32,030 importance right I think some questions 538 00:24:37,780 --> 00:24:36,230 for us do I just want to remind everyone 539 00:24:41,140 --> 00:24:37,790 that we are taking questions over the 540 00:24:42,970 --> 00:24:41,150 course until two o'clock you can send 541 00:24:46,090 --> 00:24:42,980 them by Google hangout by the Twitter 542 00:24:48,610 --> 00:24:46,100 hashtag Van Alen and we'll start 543 00:24:50,110 --> 00:24:48,620 throwing some of them out now first one 544 00:24:53,289 --> 00:24:50,120 we're going with is from at nikka 545 00:24:56,470 --> 00:24:53,299 Potamus the question is what are the 546 00:24:58,750 --> 00:24:56,480 conditions that influence when the 3rd 547 00:25:00,220 --> 00:24:58,760 Van Allen belt is measurable and how is 548 00:25:02,740 --> 00:25:00,230 it that it has never been noticed before 549 00:25:04,900 --> 00:25:02,750 I'm gonna throw that question to Sasha 550 00:25:07,299 --> 00:25:04,910 for starters and if other people want to 551 00:25:09,669 --> 00:25:07,309 jump in they made you so - that is a 552 00:25:11,740 --> 00:25:09,679 very good question and I mean if we knew 553 00:25:15,490 --> 00:25:11,750 all the conditions probably we didn't 554 00:25:17,799 --> 00:25:15,500 need to fly Van Allen probes at all 555 00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:17,809 because then we would have known all the 556 00:25:23,710 --> 00:25:20,450 answers so this is basically up for the 557 00:25:27,190 --> 00:25:23,720 discussion in science papers and science 558 00:25:31,990 --> 00:25:27,200 analysis that we're running there isn't 559 00:25:34,590 --> 00:25:32,000 is that we don't really we didn't have 560 00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:34,600 this you know really comprehensive 561 00:25:40,450 --> 00:25:38,210 capability of going basically producing 562 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:40,460 radial cuts that you saw in the 563 00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:43,570 visualization that appeared on my screen 564 00:25:50,980 --> 00:25:47,410 and getting these almost instantaneous 565 00:25:54,220 --> 00:25:50,990 snapshots of radiation intensity and its 566 00:25:57,430 --> 00:25:54,230 variability across the entire the entire 567 00:25:59,950 --> 00:25:57,440 system now actually after it was 568 00:26:04,060 --> 00:25:59,960 discovered to be profound several other 569 00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:04,070 datasets where we see indications of of 570 00:26:10,510 --> 00:26:06,850 similar structures but this will be 571 00:26:13,090 --> 00:26:10,520 definitely up for in-depth science 572 00:26:16,030 --> 00:26:13,100 analysis and discussion because that's 573 00:26:18,190 --> 00:26:16,040 tree and David mentioned multiple times 574 00:26:21,159 --> 00:26:18,200 there is a whole complexity and 575 00:26:23,950 --> 00:26:21,169 multitude of various acceleration and 576 00:26:26,440 --> 00:26:23,960 loss processes that can create this 577 00:26:29,380 --> 00:26:26,450 really complex profile and variable 578 00:26:34,630 --> 00:26:29,390 profile of radiation intensities across 579 00:26:36,790 --> 00:26:34,640 the building great I will add on another 580 00:26:39,610 --> 00:26:36,800 question here you'll notice down in your 581 00:26:41,409 --> 00:26:39,620 thumbnails there's a big image of a son 582 00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:41,419 if you anyone is watching wants to click 583 00:26:43,230 --> 00:26:41,650 on 584 00:26:45,290 --> 00:26:43,240 that it'll show up you can see it nice 585 00:26:50,130 --> 00:26:45,300 and large the middle of your screen 586 00:26:53,460 --> 00:26:50,140 that is an image of a prominence that 587 00:26:54,690 --> 00:26:53,470 occurred almost at the same time as the 588 00:26:57,780 --> 00:26:54,700 launch the Van Allen probes we have a 589 00:27:00,720 --> 00:26:57,790 question from David Saul who is 590 00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:00,730 wondering about that prominence he's 591 00:27:06,570 --> 00:27:04,210 asking how how long it is and and 592 00:27:07,890 --> 00:27:06,580 probably other information about what 593 00:27:10,110 --> 00:27:07,900 happened what it sent out I'm gonna 594 00:27:12,780 --> 00:27:10,120 throw that question to Alex Young 595 00:27:14,870 --> 00:27:12,790 because I know he has watched this 596 00:27:18,990 --> 00:27:14,880 prominence and commented on it before 597 00:27:20,460 --> 00:27:19,000 yes so so what you're looking at and the 598 00:27:22,710 --> 00:27:20,470 structure is a little bit hard to 599 00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:22,720 measure first because we're looking at 600 00:27:27,870 --> 00:27:24,610 it in a two-dimensional image and we're 601 00:27:33,140 --> 00:27:27,880 looking at an angle but just doing a 602 00:27:37,050 --> 00:27:33,150 rough estimate it's at least 30 plus 603 00:27:40,470 --> 00:27:37,060 Earth's side-by-side and turn in in 604 00:27:42,570 --> 00:27:40,480 length so hundreds of thousands of miles 605 00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:42,580 up to hundreds of thousands of miles so 606 00:27:49,650 --> 00:27:46,330 this is a incredibly huge structure and 607 00:27:53,700 --> 00:27:49,660 the earth itself would be completely 608 00:27:56,670 --> 00:27:53,710 dwarfed by this and what happens is we 609 00:28:00,690 --> 00:27:56,680 have this material on the surface of the 610 00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:00,700 Sun it's relatively cool compared to the 611 00:28:04,620 --> 00:28:02,770 surrounding atmosphere this is material 612 00:28:08,820 --> 00:28:04,630 from lower down in the solar atmosphere 613 00:28:11,580 --> 00:28:08,830 that sits up much higher in what we call 614 00:28:15,120 --> 00:28:11,590 the corona the outer atmosphere and it's 615 00:28:17,760 --> 00:28:15,130 supported by magnetic fields we don't 616 00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:17,770 exactly understand the full mechanism 617 00:28:22,650 --> 00:28:20,650 but in some ways you can sort of think 618 00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:22,660 of it like a long skinny balloon that's 619 00:28:26,820 --> 00:28:25,330 been held down by lots of strings and 620 00:28:29,910 --> 00:28:26,830 that's the magnetic field and 621 00:28:34,850 --> 00:28:29,920 occasionally those magnetic fields 622 00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:34,860 become unstable when they do that they 623 00:28:39,780 --> 00:28:37,450 basically pop they release energy and 624 00:28:42,900 --> 00:28:39,790 something we call so I pleasant is this 625 00:28:45,780 --> 00:28:42,910 called magnetic reconnection and that 626 00:28:50,130 --> 00:28:45,790 accelerates this big piece of solar 627 00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:50,140 material out in the space at millions of 628 00:28:55,470 --> 00:28:53,410 miles an hour and once it leaves the Sun 629 00:28:58,410 --> 00:28:55,480 and enters space we call 630 00:29:02,220 --> 00:28:58,420 a coronal mass ejection and so this is 631 00:29:04,410 --> 00:29:02,230 the material that eventually becomes 632 00:29:08,100 --> 00:29:04,420 that giant blob I was talking about that 633 00:29:11,280 --> 00:29:08,110 will travel and sometimes slams into the 634 00:29:12,980 --> 00:29:11,290 Earth's magnetic field or the Earth's 635 00:29:15,420 --> 00:29:12,990 magnetic system called the magnetosphere 636 00:29:17,190 --> 00:29:15,430 right and actually inject energy into 637 00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:17,200 the the outer ring is that is that right 638 00:29:21,930 --> 00:29:19,210 exactly well you remember you saw the 639 00:29:25,260 --> 00:29:21,940 video that Sachi was showing with the 640 00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:25,270 magnetic fields kind of wiggling when 641 00:29:30,540 --> 00:29:27,850 this coronal mass ejection slams into 642 00:29:33,300 --> 00:29:30,550 the magnetosphere it's almost like 643 00:29:35,910 --> 00:29:33,310 hitting a bell it causes it to ring the 644 00:29:39,660 --> 00:29:35,920 magnetic fields move back and forth and 645 00:29:41,070 --> 00:29:39,670 oscillate and that's that's putting 646 00:29:43,290 --> 00:29:41,080 energy in the system and one of the 647 00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:43,300 things that that's doing it's actually 648 00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:46,330 generating electrical currents if you 649 00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:49,690 take a magnetic field and change it 650 00:29:56,940 --> 00:29:53,890 quickly it generates a current and those 651 00:30:00,690 --> 00:29:56,950 currents build up in the upper 652 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:00,700 atmosphere and can eventually be induced 653 00:30:04,580 --> 00:30:02,290 and can eventually induce currents on 654 00:30:10,350 --> 00:30:04,590 the ground and that's a huge concern 655 00:30:13,740 --> 00:30:10,360 because it can affect power grids long 656 00:30:15,930 --> 00:30:13,750 pipe lines that's that's one of the 657 00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:15,940 major impacts of space weather that were 658 00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:20,050 very concerned about great thanks do you 659 00:30:25,650 --> 00:30:22,690 have another question Karen absolutely 660 00:30:29,370 --> 00:30:25,660 um I actually I wouldn't mind doing a 661 00:30:31,590 --> 00:30:29,380 quick follow-up on that then I'll go to 662 00:30:34,050 --> 00:30:31,600 the next question but Shree do you think 663 00:30:37,920 --> 00:30:34,060 you could comment quickly about that 664 00:30:40,980 --> 00:30:37,930 particular prominence and the sámi since 665 00:30:43,250 --> 00:30:40,990 this obviously happened right when the 666 00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:43,260 launch happened it didn't necessarily 667 00:30:50,160 --> 00:30:47,290 cause the influx of energy that was the 668 00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:50,170 solar storm you launched into but it may 669 00:30:54,810 --> 00:30:51,970 have had some effect causing an 670 00:30:56,880 --> 00:30:54,820 interplanetary shock that that initiated 671 00:30:58,260 --> 00:30:56,890 that third radiation belt maybe you can 672 00:30:59,970 --> 00:30:58,270 comment on that whether or not they were 673 00:31:03,480 --> 00:30:59,980 connected or what you're thinking if 674 00:31:06,810 --> 00:31:03,490 they were active yeah so 675 00:31:08,460 --> 00:31:06,820 it's hard to say you know rather this 676 00:31:12,000 --> 00:31:08,470 particular one it caused it but in 677 00:31:15,270 --> 00:31:12,010 general when there is a interplanetary 678 00:31:19,770 --> 00:31:15,280 shock or a coronal mass ejection what 679 00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:19,780 often happens is that we see a loss of 680 00:31:26,130 --> 00:31:22,210 particles which we call a drop out and 681 00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:26,140 then they emerge again sometimes 682 00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:28,570 stronger sometimes more intense 683 00:31:39,990 --> 00:31:33,490 sometimes anemic sometimes to the same 684 00:31:42,260 --> 00:31:40,000 level in this case the event that caused 685 00:31:46,470 --> 00:31:42,270 the drop out and the subsequent 686 00:31:49,770 --> 00:31:46,480 energization resulted in this third belt 687 00:31:53,220 --> 00:31:49,780 and that is the puzzle we are trying to 688 00:31:55,950 --> 00:31:53,230 understand why it did not behave why the 689 00:31:59,850 --> 00:31:55,960 magnetosphere did not behave the way it 690 00:32:03,300 --> 00:31:59,860 usually does and you know this is also 691 00:32:05,630 --> 00:32:03,310 in response to the earlier question this 692 00:32:10,340 --> 00:32:05,640 is a clear case where I believe 693 00:32:12,630 --> 00:32:10,350 observation leads theory or models 694 00:32:15,540 --> 00:32:12,640 observations suddenly thrown out a 695 00:32:19,830 --> 00:32:15,550 challenge we have we have seen something 696 00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:19,840 in nature and now it's up to modelers 697 00:32:27,390 --> 00:32:24,610 like Sasha who can theorize and give us 698 00:32:32,370 --> 00:32:27,400 a theoretical a physical explanation as 699 00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:32,380 to what's going on and so the 700 00:32:39,630 --> 00:32:34,090 observation is really in this case 701 00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:39,640 leading the whole scene alright let me 702 00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:43,210 bring in question from Tommy Henley who 703 00:32:48,900 --> 00:32:45,610 sent in a question by a Facebook and 704 00:32:51,300 --> 00:32:48,910 he's asking about the instruments on the 705 00:32:53,490 --> 00:32:51,310 probes what they measure he asks does 706 00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:53,500 the did the instruments measure the 707 00:32:58,530 --> 00:32:57,130 intensity of the energy field and wants 708 00:33:00,360 --> 00:32:58,540 to know what they saw in the second 709 00:33:02,190 --> 00:33:00,370 radiation belt did the second radiation 710 00:33:04,620 --> 00:33:02,200 belt attain a fairly constant and 711 00:33:08,850 --> 00:33:04,630 maximum intensity during the existence 712 00:33:10,860 --> 00:33:08,860 of the third radiation belt and I would 713 00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:10,870 love to hear both from David about the 714 00:33:14,640 --> 00:33:12,370 instruments specifically on the Van 715 00:33:17,140 --> 00:33:14,650 Allen probes what they what they measure 716 00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:17,150 and and then 717 00:33:20,789 --> 00:33:19,250 sascha maybe you can tell us what what 718 00:33:23,260 --> 00:33:20,799 was seeing the second radiation belt 719 00:33:26,350 --> 00:33:23,270 okay I think that's a good division of 720 00:33:29,049 --> 00:33:26,360 labor the instruments on the Van Allen 721 00:33:32,049 --> 00:33:29,059 probes measure the magnetic fields that 722 00:33:34,750 --> 00:33:32,059 confine and trap these dangerous 723 00:33:37,419 --> 00:33:34,760 radiation particles in Earth's near 724 00:33:39,850 --> 00:33:37,429 environment they measure the electric 725 00:33:42,580 --> 00:33:39,860 fields that can give energy to the 726 00:33:44,830 --> 00:33:42,590 particles out in space and they measure 727 00:33:47,289 --> 00:33:44,840 the full range of particles from the 728 00:33:49,990 --> 00:33:47,299 lowest possible energies up to many 729 00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:50,000 millions of degrees of temperature or 730 00:33:56,950 --> 00:33:52,730 energy they measure the composition of 731 00:33:59,260 --> 00:33:56,960 the particles protons helium oxygen all 732 00:34:02,110 --> 00:33:59,270 these observations are needed to give us 733 00:34:04,539 --> 00:34:02,120 the clues about how particles are 734 00:34:06,070 --> 00:34:04,549 energized from the relatively cold 735 00:34:09,010 --> 00:34:06,080 energies that the Earth's ionosphere 736 00:34:11,409 --> 00:34:09,020 provides or a bit warmer from the solar 737 00:34:18,010 --> 00:34:11,419 wind up to these dangerous energies and 738 00:34:22,750 --> 00:34:18,020 with that I'll pass it to Sasha what I 739 00:34:25,359 --> 00:34:22,760 would like to also add to David Davis 740 00:34:28,210 --> 00:34:25,369 description is that we perhaps should be 741 00:34:31,119 --> 00:34:28,220 very clear that by radiation 742 00:34:33,730 --> 00:34:31,129 in this specific context of radiation 743 00:34:37,419 --> 00:34:33,740 belts we mean very very high-energy 744 00:34:39,879 --> 00:34:37,429 particles that can produce damaging 745 00:34:43,270 --> 00:34:39,889 effects the technology or to astronauts 746 00:34:45,460 --> 00:34:43,280 as we already have been discussing but 747 00:34:47,649 --> 00:34:45,470 the goal of our mission is not just 748 00:34:50,530 --> 00:34:47,659 measure these intensities the 749 00:34:52,659 --> 00:34:50,540 intensities of these particles basically 750 00:34:56,050 --> 00:34:52,669 how many at what energies these 751 00:35:00,700 --> 00:34:56,060 particles are but really understand what 752 00:35:04,170 --> 00:35:00,710 governs the basic increases or decreases 753 00:35:08,500 --> 00:35:04,180 and these intensities and this is why 754 00:35:11,170 --> 00:35:08,510 why we need to measure as David just 755 00:35:14,859 --> 00:35:11,180 pointed out all possible energies and 756 00:35:17,620 --> 00:35:14,869 all wave magnetic or electric fields 757 00:35:21,070 --> 00:35:17,630 that can contribute to both production 758 00:35:24,150 --> 00:35:21,080 and losses of this radiation across the 759 00:35:27,310 --> 00:35:24,160 entire inner magnetospheric system and 760 00:35:30,910 --> 00:35:27,320 as it was a very good question because 761 00:35:34,030 --> 00:35:30,920 it kind of led us to have 762 00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:34,040 to mention again that the inner most 763 00:35:40,650 --> 00:35:37,130 part of the magnetosphere which is the 764 00:35:43,089 --> 00:35:40,660 inner belt region is January stable 765 00:35:44,950 --> 00:35:43,099 usually and you know it's important to 766 00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:44,960 understand that sometimes we do have 767 00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:47,690 very dramatic effects that affect the 768 00:35:53,799 --> 00:35:50,450 entire system but usually the magnetic 769 00:35:56,710 --> 00:35:53,809 and electric fields in the inner belt 770 00:36:00,010 --> 00:35:56,720 are more or less quiet so that's why the 771 00:36:04,980 --> 00:36:00,020 inner belt system is more or less stable 772 00:36:07,210 --> 00:36:04,990 and this is what exactly what was shown 773 00:36:11,430 --> 00:36:07,220 bye-bye-bye-bye these measurements that 774 00:36:16,270 --> 00:36:11,440 while the outer belt dynamics was really 775 00:36:19,900 --> 00:36:16,280 you know dynamic and rapid and different 776 00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:19,910 at different radial distances the inner 777 00:36:29,380 --> 00:36:26,210 belt was very very quiet I think alex is 778 00:36:32,319 --> 00:36:29,390 gonna add on something to that too yeah 779 00:36:34,620 --> 00:36:32,329 I just wanted to mention that one of the 780 00:36:38,109 --> 00:36:34,630 areas that were very interested in is 781 00:36:40,990 --> 00:36:38,119 trying to predict the whole chain of 782 00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:41,000 events when the coronal mass ejection 783 00:36:46,299 --> 00:36:43,970 impacts the magnetosphere and understand 784 00:36:48,579 --> 00:36:46,309 exactly what is the impact for example 785 00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:48,589 on the ground and this inner area 786 00:36:54,609 --> 00:36:52,970 between the upper atmosphere atmosphere 787 00:36:57,250 --> 00:36:54,619 through into the ministry or this whole 788 00:36:59,859 --> 00:36:57,260 region is one of the hardest ones to 789 00:37:02,799 --> 00:36:59,869 understand but once we don't understand 790 00:37:05,620 --> 00:37:02,809 very well so this is just one more piece 791 00:37:07,530 --> 00:37:05,630 of this puzzle of connecting these 792 00:37:11,460 --> 00:37:07,540 different parts of the whole system 793 00:37:15,339 --> 00:37:11,470 and it's you know giving us an 794 00:37:20,020 --> 00:37:15,349 incredibly you know new dynamic look at 795 00:37:24,730 --> 00:37:20,030 this whole process great another 796 00:37:28,089 --> 00:37:24,740 question in a from at virtua Linda who 797 00:37:31,380 --> 00:37:28,099 is asking us do the Van Allen belts 798 00:37:34,839 --> 00:37:31,390 change when there is a CME from the Sun 799 00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:34,849 we talked about this a little bit but we 800 00:37:38,910 --> 00:37:36,530 have a couple of questions on this I 801 00:37:43,390 --> 00:37:38,920 want to go over it again that as well as 802 00:37:44,680 --> 00:37:43,400 as a question of what just one of the 803 00:37:46,630 --> 00:37:44,690 conditions in general 804 00:37:49,569 --> 00:37:46,640 that influence bringing on the third 805 00:37:51,940 --> 00:37:49,579 radiation belt and and is it just it's 806 00:37:54,730 --> 00:37:51,950 too small to see normally or or what's 807 00:37:59,079 --> 00:37:54,740 what's making it pump up into being 808 00:38:03,460 --> 00:37:59,089 something visible why don't I start with 809 00:38:08,040 --> 00:38:03,470 sri on that one okay 810 00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:08,050 yes in general coronal mass ejections 811 00:38:13,000 --> 00:38:11,210 disturbances from the sun which are 812 00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:13,010 headed towards Earth and impact the 813 00:38:21,370 --> 00:38:18,770 magnetosphere have results in some 814 00:38:24,670 --> 00:38:21,380 dynamically change in the radiation belt 815 00:38:27,599 --> 00:38:24,680 system most of the time the change is 816 00:38:32,380 --> 00:38:27,609 effected only in the outer radiation 817 00:38:35,589 --> 00:38:32,390 sometimes the disturbance and the impact 818 00:38:40,569 --> 00:38:35,599 is so strong that it it creates a whole 819 00:38:44,470 --> 00:38:40,579 slew of particles which will move 820 00:38:47,050 --> 00:38:44,480 inwards and even join the innermost belt 821 00:38:52,630 --> 00:38:47,060 the proton the general leader is stable 822 00:38:56,800 --> 00:38:52,640 the generally stable performance in as 823 00:38:58,210 --> 00:38:56,810 to what causes as to what caused the 824 00:39:00,609 --> 00:38:58,220 third radiation belt I have already 825 00:39:04,089 --> 00:39:00,619 mentioned you know we are trying to 826 00:39:07,300 --> 00:39:04,099 understand theoretically why the belt 827 00:39:10,410 --> 00:39:07,310 stayed stable why it did not just mix up 828 00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:10,420 and become we'd just back to two bells 829 00:39:19,059 --> 00:39:15,890 that we have to understand however the 830 00:39:22,270 --> 00:39:19,069 dynamical changes that are caused by 831 00:39:25,690 --> 00:39:22,280 these solar drivers the plasma blobs the 832 00:39:28,990 --> 00:39:25,700 coronal mass ejections they result in a 833 00:39:31,150 --> 00:39:29,000 very complex response by the 834 00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:31,160 magnetosphere as I mentioned sometimes 835 00:39:37,089 --> 00:39:34,010 the intensities increase and the 836 00:39:39,460 --> 00:39:37,099 increase is often orders of magnitude 837 00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:39,470 like ten thousand times the original 838 00:39:44,710 --> 00:39:42,770 level of electrons sometimes they don't 839 00:39:47,950 --> 00:39:44,720 change at all sometimes they actually 840 00:39:53,770 --> 00:39:47,960 get wiped away and why these things 841 00:39:58,040 --> 00:39:53,780 happen in a given particular in event is 842 00:40:04,040 --> 00:39:58,050 is the subject of scientific inquiry 843 00:40:10,870 --> 00:40:04,050 I hope that answers the question I think 844 00:40:13,100 --> 00:40:10,880 so we have a question from at NBC Cohen 845 00:40:15,500 --> 00:40:13,110 he's asking what percentage of the 846 00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:15,510 protection to earth comes from the new 847 00:40:20,630 --> 00:40:17,850 third belt compared to the other two now 848 00:40:22,670 --> 00:40:20,640 my understanding is of course that the 849 00:40:24,740 --> 00:40:22,680 radiation belts are not offering us 850 00:40:26,720 --> 00:40:24,750 protection or maybe they are are the 851 00:40:30,260 --> 00:40:26,730 radiation belts offering us protection 852 00:40:31,610 --> 00:40:30,270 from incoming events on the Sun and if 853 00:40:35,660 --> 00:40:31,620 it's not the radiation belts that are 854 00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:35,670 doing it what it is why don't I send 855 00:40:42,020 --> 00:40:40,050 that to the - Alex please actually I 856 00:40:43,930 --> 00:40:42,030 think that's probably the Dave should 857 00:40:48,080 --> 00:40:43,940 answer David should answer that 858 00:40:50,720 --> 00:40:48,090 okay well the radiation belts are 859 00:40:53,090 --> 00:40:50,730 confined in the immediate vicinity of 860 00:40:55,370 --> 00:40:53,100 the earth by the Earth's magnetic field 861 00:40:58,010 --> 00:40:55,380 they're not shielding us from anything 862 00:40:59,930 --> 00:40:58,020 they're trapped and circling around the 863 00:41:02,420 --> 00:40:59,940 earth and these doughnut shaped regions 864 00:41:04,790 --> 00:41:02,430 and they're posing a hazard to us they 865 00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:04,800 don't protect us from anything further 866 00:41:08,750 --> 00:41:06,930 out they're trapped by the Earth's 867 00:41:10,790 --> 00:41:08,760 magnetic field the Earth's magnetic 868 00:41:13,940 --> 00:41:10,800 field is a buffer that's trying to 869 00:41:15,920 --> 00:41:13,950 shield us from particles further out but 870 00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:15,930 some of those particles get in get 871 00:41:19,220 --> 00:41:17,970 energized and become the Earth's 872 00:41:25,430 --> 00:41:19,230 radiation belts 873 00:41:28,340 --> 00:41:25,440 I think Sasha may have more to say maybe 874 00:41:32,690 --> 00:41:28,350 just to add a little bit it's just it's 875 00:41:35,180 --> 00:41:32,700 important to emphasize that the inner 876 00:41:39,290 --> 00:41:35,190 magnetospheric system where radiation 877 00:41:42,770 --> 00:41:39,300 belts are embedded in X actually as an 878 00:41:46,430 --> 00:41:42,780 accelerator there there is an um there a 879 00:41:49,700 --> 00:41:46,440 number of wave or you know few of 880 00:41:52,010 --> 00:41:49,710 processes that accelerate particles and 881 00:41:54,170 --> 00:41:52,020 it's not particles that are coming 882 00:41:56,780 --> 00:41:54,180 directly from the Sun although of course 883 00:42:00,080 --> 00:41:56,790 ultimately the Sun is the driver of all 884 00:42:02,420 --> 00:42:00,090 the TVG that is affecting us but 885 00:42:05,960 --> 00:42:02,430 something else and some others are 886 00:42:08,440 --> 00:42:05,970 indicative of activities happen across 887 00:42:11,150 --> 00:42:08,450 the inner magnetosphere which sometimes 888 00:42:11,960 --> 00:42:11,160 accelerate particles at very large 889 00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:11,970 quantity 890 00:42:18,050 --> 00:42:15,210 two very large energies and this is what 891 00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:18,060 basically creates the inner belt and 892 00:42:23,839 --> 00:42:21,690 outer belt populations and we mentioned 893 00:42:26,570 --> 00:42:23,849 space weather a number of times but it's 894 00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:26,580 also is important to understand that you 895 00:42:30,620 --> 00:42:28,410 know these you know high-energy 896 00:42:33,310 --> 00:42:30,630 particles cannot be created at earth 897 00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:33,320 except you know in you know very 898 00:42:37,910 --> 00:42:37,170 expensive and very different laboratory 899 00:42:41,960 --> 00:42:37,920 conditions 900 00:42:44,390 --> 00:42:41,970 but having observations right inside of 901 00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:44,400 the inner magnetosphere where these 902 00:42:50,180 --> 00:42:47,490 radiation belts are basically provide us 903 00:42:52,370 --> 00:42:50,190 with natural laboratory for 904 00:42:54,589 --> 00:42:52,380 understanding how particles are 905 00:42:57,290 --> 00:42:54,599 accelerated across the universe which is 906 00:43:00,020 --> 00:42:57,300 really as a fundamental question that we 907 00:43:02,660 --> 00:43:00,030 did start extremely excited about and 908 00:43:06,500 --> 00:43:02,670 these are unprecedented observations 909 00:43:07,849 --> 00:43:06,510 that us means well okay okay can I ask a 910 00:43:11,210 --> 00:43:07,859 follow-up on that because that's a very 911 00:43:13,070 --> 00:43:11,220 interesting point there so you're saying 912 00:43:15,530 --> 00:43:13,080 that studying these belts complements 913 00:43:17,030 --> 00:43:15,540 you know this ten billion dollar Large 914 00:43:19,700 --> 00:43:17,040 Hadron Collider we built here on earth 915 00:43:24,050 --> 00:43:19,710 is that kind of what you're saying it 916 00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:24,060 actually in some sense yes in the sense 917 00:43:32,270 --> 00:43:28,650 that from both remote observations and 918 00:43:35,500 --> 00:43:32,280 direct observations at our other outer 919 00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:35,510 planets like Saturn and Jupiter or 920 00:43:41,210 --> 00:43:38,490 basic-cable active Center and other 921 00:43:44,240 --> 00:43:41,220 systems we know that if you have 922 00:43:47,270 --> 00:43:44,250 strongly magnetized and by that I mean 923 00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:47,280 systems with magnetic field it tends to 924 00:43:52,370 --> 00:43:50,010 create very high energy particle 925 00:43:54,650 --> 00:43:52,380 population which is basically important 926 00:43:59,150 --> 00:43:54,660 to understand for us to understand how 927 00:44:02,780 --> 00:43:59,160 the universe works and we cannot create 928 00:44:05,359 --> 00:44:02,790 a fly to Andromeda or to the galactic 929 00:44:07,820 --> 00:44:05,369 center or even to Jupiter it's very 930 00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:07,830 expensive but right you know here in our 931 00:44:14,420 --> 00:44:11,010 backyard would basically have perfect 932 00:44:16,790 --> 00:44:14,430 conditions for just stepping outside and 933 00:44:20,690 --> 00:44:16,800 looking how these particles are being 934 00:44:23,930 --> 00:44:20,700 produced and how these populations are 935 00:44:25,730 --> 00:44:23,940 affected by electric and magnetic waves 936 00:44:28,000 --> 00:44:25,740 that basically 937 00:44:31,430 --> 00:44:28,010 to shape them up which is an extremely 938 00:44:34,970 --> 00:44:31,440 fundamental question and yes ultimately 939 00:44:39,320 --> 00:44:34,980 maybe unlocking some some some mysteries 940 00:44:42,920 --> 00:44:39,330 related to two elementary particles I 941 00:44:46,790 --> 00:44:42,930 don't help it well if I may if I may 942 00:44:51,040 --> 00:44:46,800 jump in I I would I would say somewhat 943 00:44:54,109 --> 00:44:51,050 differently I would say the LHC and 944 00:44:57,710 --> 00:44:54,119 those sorts of endeavors are somewhat 945 00:44:59,930 --> 00:44:57,720 complementary to what we are doing they 946 00:45:02,270 --> 00:44:59,940 probe different energy regimes they 947 00:45:05,060 --> 00:45:02,280 probe different phenomena but what is 948 00:45:09,410 --> 00:45:05,070 interesting to to amplify what Sasha 949 00:45:12,950 --> 00:45:09,420 said the energization processes that 950 00:45:15,530 --> 00:45:12,960 occur in the radiation belts in our own 951 00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:15,540 backyard as it would occur throughout 952 00:45:23,390 --> 00:45:20,010 the universe and in order to understand 953 00:45:26,060 --> 00:45:23,400 if we understand processes completely 954 00:45:29,090 --> 00:45:26,070 fully here we would be able to 955 00:45:31,250 --> 00:45:29,100 understand these processes occurring if 956 00:45:40,460 --> 00:45:31,260 distant parts of the universe so from 957 00:45:41,150 --> 00:45:40,470 that sense what we do is important all 958 00:45:44,300 --> 00:45:41,160 right 959 00:45:45,980 --> 00:45:44,310 just reminder we have about 15 minutes 960 00:45:48,470 --> 00:45:45,990 left so we're still taking questions 961 00:45:50,300 --> 00:45:48,480 until 2:00 o'clock you can send them to 962 00:45:52,900 --> 00:45:50,310 us by the Goddard Facebook page you can 963 00:45:57,260 --> 00:45:52,910 send them to us via a Google+ Hangout or 964 00:46:00,680 --> 00:45:57,270 via the Twitter hashtag Van Allen VA n a 965 00:46:04,430 --> 00:46:00,690 a sorry VA na llen 966 00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:04,440 and we have a question from someone by a 967 00:46:13,730 --> 00:46:09,930 google+ andrew planet asks the planetary 968 00:46:15,950 --> 00:46:13,740 magnetic field alters the patterns in 969 00:46:18,290 --> 00:46:15,960 charged particles relative to the 970 00:46:20,720 --> 00:46:18,300 changing intensity to the energy applied 971 00:46:22,849 --> 00:46:20,730 to it I wonder if it'd be easy to 972 00:46:25,130 --> 00:46:22,859 replicate the conditions that produces 973 00:46:27,320 --> 00:46:25,140 the Van Allen belt in an experiment in a 974 00:46:29,599 --> 00:46:27,330 lab on earth this would be especially 975 00:46:31,310 --> 00:46:29,609 interesting with all the new data sort 976 00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:31,320 of the flip side to talking about using 977 00:46:38,489 --> 00:46:35,130 a space as a laboratory can you recreate 978 00:46:45,329 --> 00:46:38,499 that environment on earth in the lab 979 00:46:49,049 --> 00:46:45,339 and let I can throw that out who wants 980 00:46:51,630 --> 00:46:49,059 to take that way I'll start for a minute 981 00:46:53,729 --> 00:46:51,640 and then pass it on it's a great idea 982 00:46:55,470 --> 00:46:53,739 it's an idea that scientists are working 983 00:46:58,079 --> 00:46:55,480 on in fact it's an idea that they've 984 00:47:00,479 --> 00:46:58,089 been working on for many many years 985 00:47:02,549 --> 00:47:00,489 the earliest torella experiments 986 00:47:05,700 --> 00:47:02,559 involves shooting beams of charged 987 00:47:07,739 --> 00:47:05,710 particles at a magnetic field simulating 988 00:47:09,749 --> 00:47:07,749 their Earth's magnetic field and saying 989 00:47:12,180 --> 00:47:09,759 which way those particles go and how 990 00:47:14,849 --> 00:47:12,190 they get trapped but the difficulty here 991 00:47:16,349 --> 00:47:14,859 is the change in scale size in your lab 992 00:47:18,960 --> 00:47:16,359 you can only have a little small 993 00:47:20,880 --> 00:47:18,970 magnetic field and you can't get all the 994 00:47:22,349 --> 00:47:20,890 phenomena on the right scales that 995 00:47:25,229 --> 00:47:22,359 happen out in space 996 00:47:27,239 --> 00:47:25,239 so we do conduct lab experiments put 997 00:47:29,370 --> 00:47:27,249 probes into them and measure waves 998 00:47:31,650 --> 00:47:29,380 measure their effect on the particles 999 00:47:33,749 --> 00:47:31,660 and we do our best and we also conduct 1000 00:47:35,819 --> 00:47:33,759 simulations where we put in all the 1001 00:47:37,799 --> 00:47:35,829 factors we believe are should be 1002 00:47:39,930 --> 00:47:37,809 occurring and then press the button and 1003 00:47:42,479 --> 00:47:39,940 let those simulations run and try to 1004 00:47:46,650 --> 00:47:42,489 predict what will happen maybe someone 1005 00:47:48,809 --> 00:47:46,660 else will comment - well I I wanted to 1006 00:47:51,120 --> 00:47:48,819 add to that and I guess kind of back to 1007 00:47:54,420 --> 00:47:51,130 what Sheree and Sasha was talking about 1008 00:47:56,849 --> 00:47:54,430 that the the one of the most exciting 1009 00:48:01,589 --> 00:47:56,859 things is that we do have a new 1010 00:48:03,900 --> 00:48:01,599 laboratory because plasma processes and 1011 00:48:06,329 --> 00:48:03,910 particle acceleration processes are 1012 00:48:09,210 --> 00:48:06,339 ubiquitous throughout the whole universe 1013 00:48:13,039 --> 00:48:09,220 we're always looking for different 1014 00:48:15,720 --> 00:48:13,049 places where we can sample different 1015 00:48:19,019 --> 00:48:15,730 time scales and spatial scales and 1016 00:48:21,180 --> 00:48:19,029 temporal scales to really understand all 1017 00:48:24,269 --> 00:48:21,190 the different aspects of the process so 1018 00:48:27,089 --> 00:48:24,279 this is just one more place that we have 1019 00:48:32,309 --> 00:48:27,099 a laboratory a laboratory very close to 1020 00:48:34,319 --> 00:48:32,319 us and when you think about processes in 1021 00:48:35,849 --> 00:48:34,329 the universe one of the things we're 1022 00:48:38,849 --> 00:48:35,859 trying to really understand on the Sun 1023 00:48:40,559 --> 00:48:38,859 is we know particles are accelerated to 1024 00:48:45,299 --> 00:48:40,569 create the solar wind we know particles 1025 00:48:47,970 --> 00:48:45,309 are accelerated during a solar flare so 1026 00:48:50,910 --> 00:48:47,980 we don't understand exactly how they're 1027 00:48:51,960 --> 00:48:50,920 accelerated so these particles are what 1028 00:48:55,050 --> 00:48:51,970 help 1029 00:48:57,839 --> 00:48:55,060 to create the radiation belts and we're 1030 00:48:59,760 --> 00:48:57,849 using the radiation belts now to 1031 00:49:02,730 --> 00:48:59,770 understand the acceleration processes 1032 00:49:07,020 --> 00:49:02,740 that then create the solar flares and 1033 00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:07,030 solar wind so the two are incredibly 1034 00:49:16,380 --> 00:49:12,930 complementary to each other all right 1035 00:49:20,339 --> 00:49:16,390 anyone else want to add to anything in 1036 00:49:22,980 --> 00:49:20,349 in the laboratory setting I can just 1037 00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:22,990 quickly add and basically echo what 1038 00:49:28,589 --> 00:49:25,810 David and Alex said that well there are 1039 00:49:32,220 --> 00:49:28,599 some absolutely fantastic efforts in 1040 00:49:35,730 --> 00:49:32,230 laboratory plasma the huge issue is a 1041 00:49:38,190 --> 00:49:35,740 scale size which it's almost impossible 1042 00:49:41,220 --> 00:49:38,200 to take the entire inner emergeny this 1043 00:49:43,470 --> 00:49:41,230 fear you can put it you know down in one 1044 00:49:47,400 --> 00:49:43,480 room laboratory environment and 1045 00:49:50,820 --> 00:49:47,410 unfortunately processes and energetics 1046 00:49:53,310 --> 00:49:50,830 of the system don't easily scale down at 1047 00:49:55,620 --> 00:49:53,320 that level so that's why if we want to 1048 00:49:58,560 --> 00:49:55,630 really understand what happens in 1049 00:50:00,839 --> 00:49:58,570 natural Astrophysical systems would 1050 00:50:03,060 --> 00:50:00,849 really need to once again using the same 1051 00:50:05,970 --> 00:50:03,070 analogy go to our backyard and fly a 1052 00:50:08,609 --> 00:50:05,980 little bit out of the atmosphere and 1053 00:50:12,300 --> 00:50:08,619 start sampling the system there that's 1054 00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:12,310 all I think Sasha really hit the nail on 1055 00:50:20,430 --> 00:50:14,530 the head here by saying that phenomena 1056 00:50:24,570 --> 00:50:20,440 do not ask scale if you in size so if if 1057 00:50:27,300 --> 00:50:24,580 you just take and try to miniaturize and 1058 00:50:29,790 --> 00:50:27,310 recreate Van Allen belts on earth it's 1059 00:50:32,130 --> 00:50:29,800 no guarantee that the phenomena that we 1060 00:50:34,470 --> 00:50:32,140 observe in nature will also be present 1061 00:50:38,310 --> 00:50:34,480 in the scaled-down version that's the 1062 00:50:39,810 --> 00:50:38,320 key I can't help but wonder if you guys 1063 00:50:43,170 --> 00:50:39,820 have been talking with these folks who 1064 00:50:44,670 --> 00:50:43,180 are trying to make magnetic fusion work 1065 00:50:46,140 --> 00:50:44,680 as an energy source here on earth you 1066 00:50:48,150 --> 00:50:46,150 know they're trying to create plasmas 1067 00:50:50,430 --> 00:50:48,160 and magnetically contain them in the lab 1068 00:50:52,740 --> 00:50:50,440 have you talked any fusion researchers 1069 00:50:54,990 --> 00:50:52,750 about what you guys are doing it's 1070 00:50:59,250 --> 00:50:55,000 interesting you bring that up dry and 1071 00:51:01,380 --> 00:50:59,260 because I think there are many there are 1072 00:51:04,230 --> 00:51:01,390 some aspects which actually apply to 1073 00:51:06,079 --> 00:51:04,240 both fields things like plasma 1074 00:51:10,680 --> 00:51:06,089 instabilities and so on 1075 00:51:12,890 --> 00:51:10,690 indeed it's it's not unusual to see a 1076 00:51:16,289 --> 00:51:12,900 plasma physicist wandering into the 1077 00:51:19,620 --> 00:51:16,299 space science arena and vice-versa and I 1078 00:51:26,579 --> 00:51:19,630 think probably Sasha might actually have 1079 00:51:30,109 --> 00:51:26,589 more to add to this no I think you've 1080 00:51:33,210 --> 00:51:30,119 done a good job she in a sense that as 1081 00:51:35,760 --> 00:51:33,220 has been said before the processes that 1082 00:51:38,099 --> 00:51:35,770 accelerate particles are ubiquitous and 1083 00:51:40,710 --> 00:51:38,109 they're lots of lessons that we can 1084 00:51:45,530 --> 00:51:40,720 learn from each other however there are 1085 00:51:48,980 --> 00:51:45,540 some very basic differences between the 1086 00:51:53,190 --> 00:51:48,990 laboratory experiments that target a 1087 00:51:56,039 --> 00:51:53,200 controlled fusion and the regime's in 1088 00:51:57,720 --> 00:51:56,049 space plasma okay it's kind of a very 1089 00:52:02,069 --> 00:51:57,730 short version without getting into 1090 00:52:04,230 --> 00:52:02,079 technical right there a little bit my 1091 00:52:05,849 --> 00:52:04,240 curiosity got to me but maybe this is a 1092 00:52:08,789 --> 00:52:05,859 good time to just kind of remind the 1093 00:52:10,440 --> 00:52:08,799 viewers what this overall mission was 1094 00:52:13,530 --> 00:52:10,450 all about I mean you guys hit the 1095 00:52:15,870 --> 00:52:13,540 jackpot and made a regional discovery on 1096 00:52:17,640 --> 00:52:15,880 the third day of the mission but what 1097 00:52:19,140 --> 00:52:17,650 was the point of launching these two 1098 00:52:22,200 --> 00:52:19,150 probes in the first place 1099 00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:22,210 maybe I'll go for that it's pretty basic 1100 00:52:27,450 --> 00:52:24,970 where do these energetic particles come 1101 00:52:29,730 --> 00:52:27,460 from what what causes them to get those 1102 00:52:31,799 --> 00:52:29,740 energy what moves them around and what 1103 00:52:33,780 --> 00:52:31,809 gets rid of them we've seen all of these 1104 00:52:36,539 --> 00:52:33,790 within the first few days of the mission 1105 00:52:38,670 --> 00:52:36,549 in ways we didn't ever expect to see but 1106 00:52:40,650 --> 00:52:38,680 now the point is to figure it out to 1107 00:52:43,410 --> 00:52:40,660 understand it to be able to predict it 1108 00:52:45,240 --> 00:52:43,420 to put it to use for Humanity in the 1109 00:52:52,500 --> 00:52:45,250 sense of protecting astronauts and 1110 00:52:59,859 --> 00:52:55,210 so well said that I can hardly add 1111 00:53:02,500 --> 00:52:59,869 anything to it all right 1112 00:53:05,200 --> 00:53:02,510 just a reminder we'll get your last few 1113 00:53:08,589 --> 00:53:05,210 questions and we'll be ending promptly 1114 00:53:10,150 --> 00:53:08,599 at 2:00 so send your questions by a 1115 00:53:13,059 --> 00:53:10,160 Google hangout or the Twitter hashtag 1116 00:53:16,420 --> 00:53:13,069 Van Allen and once we're finished this 1117 00:53:17,680 --> 00:53:16,430 will be up on YouTube for all time so 1118 00:53:20,920 --> 00:53:17,690 you can keep watching it over and over 1119 00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:20,930 and over again if you wish I'm gonna 1120 00:53:26,829 --> 00:53:24,170 throw in a question here which is we're 1121 00:53:29,620 --> 00:53:26,839 talking about the effects of the 1122 00:53:30,970 --> 00:53:29,630 radiation belts Menaul the discovery of 1123 00:53:32,650 --> 00:53:30,980 the radiation belt just a sort of it's a 1124 00:53:35,049 --> 00:53:32,660 cool discovery and what can that mean 1125 00:53:36,519 --> 00:53:35,059 for space weather I'd like to go a 1126 00:53:38,799 --> 00:53:36,529 little deeper into what does that mean 1127 00:53:42,490 --> 00:53:38,809 for for modeling and predicting what 1128 00:53:44,170 --> 00:53:42,500 exactly does seeing this extra belt or 1129 00:53:46,539 --> 00:53:44,180 for that matter you can think of it as 1130 00:53:49,120 --> 00:53:46,549 seeing an extra space right an extra 1131 00:53:54,250 --> 00:53:49,130 slot region between the belts what does 1132 00:53:55,870 --> 00:53:54,260 having that slot region mean for for the 1133 00:54:02,490 --> 00:53:55,880 next steps of coming up with theories 1134 00:54:08,920 --> 00:54:05,499 well we have to go back to stretch and 1135 00:54:10,680 --> 00:54:08,930 ask why do these gaps appear where did 1136 00:54:13,089 --> 00:54:10,690 the particles going where they come from 1137 00:54:15,309 --> 00:54:13,099 it's not that we have a shortage of 1138 00:54:17,740 --> 00:54:15,319 theories in fact we have a surplus of 1139 00:54:19,599 --> 00:54:17,750 theories in fact as many scientists as 1140 00:54:21,460 --> 00:54:19,609 there are there are theories and that's 1141 00:54:23,349 --> 00:54:21,470 what makes going to a science meeting so 1142 00:54:25,690 --> 00:54:23,359 interesting because you see them arguing 1143 00:54:28,150 --> 00:54:25,700 about them saying no my theory my theory 1144 00:54:30,069 --> 00:54:28,160 is the right one but the way we're going 1145 00:54:32,650 --> 00:54:30,079 to test them all of them have plausible 1146 00:54:35,200 --> 00:54:32,660 ideas is turn to people like Sacha and 1147 00:54:37,359 --> 00:54:35,210 ask him can you put this in a model can 1148 00:54:39,609 --> 00:54:37,369 you tell if we tell you it's this strong 1149 00:54:41,710 --> 00:54:39,619 and this big and happening here and now 1150 00:54:44,230 --> 00:54:41,720 run your model and tell us what you see 1151 00:54:46,390 --> 00:54:44,240 do you see what was really observed if 1152 00:54:48,339 --> 00:54:46,400 that effect doesn't work try this effect 1153 00:54:50,140 --> 00:54:48,349 move on to the next one maybe it's a 1154 00:54:52,720 --> 00:54:50,150 combination of two or three or more 1155 00:54:54,400 --> 00:54:52,730 let's get it right when Sacha gets the 1156 00:54:56,710 --> 00:54:54,410 model running right and makes 1157 00:54:58,779 --> 00:54:56,720 predictions for us then that's the model 1158 00:55:03,930 --> 00:54:58,789 we want to run to make real space 1159 00:55:08,760 --> 00:55:05,940 maybe very quick one because that once 1160 00:55:11,370 --> 00:55:08,770 again I think that you'll be sure the 1161 00:55:13,200 --> 00:55:11,380 answer can kind of encompasses it but 1162 00:55:15,450 --> 00:55:13,210 going back to Brian's question this is 1163 00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:15,460 exactly why we cannot end the mission 1164 00:55:21,510 --> 00:55:18,850 now you know we had this you know cool 1165 00:55:24,810 --> 00:55:21,520 discovery of this really interesting in 1166 00:55:28,230 --> 00:55:24,820 dynamic structure but going kind of to 1167 00:55:30,710 --> 00:55:28,240 the reason for the press conference and 1168 00:55:33,060 --> 00:55:30,720 the science paper is that structure 1169 00:55:37,170 --> 00:55:33,070 perhaps has never been observed before 1170 00:55:39,060 --> 00:55:37,180 so we just points us to again the fact 1171 00:55:42,990 --> 00:55:39,070 that we're dealing with very very 1172 00:55:45,900 --> 00:55:43,000 dynamic system and we really need 1173 00:55:47,700 --> 00:55:45,910 comprehensive measurements to use for 1174 00:55:50,610 --> 00:55:47,710 this you know models and theories that 1175 00:55:53,490 --> 00:55:50,620 they would just mention before we can 1176 00:55:56,580 --> 00:55:53,500 really constrain them or make you know 1177 00:56:00,840 --> 00:55:56,590 more questions and get more puzzled for 1178 00:56:06,540 --> 00:56:00,850 future future space missions and future 1179 00:56:08,430 --> 00:56:06,550 experiments and discoveries great uh we 1180 00:56:10,860 --> 00:56:08,440 have what is probably gonna be our last 1181 00:56:15,780 --> 00:56:10,870 question just came in from Facebook from 1182 00:56:17,280 --> 00:56:15,790 Heidi can the question is what moved you 1183 00:56:19,680 --> 00:56:17,290 to use the instruments almost 1184 00:56:22,230 --> 00:56:19,690 immediately after launch rather than 1185 00:56:29,490 --> 00:56:22,240 later why don't I start with Shree on 1186 00:56:32,040 --> 00:56:29,500 that one okay so as I mentioned we on 1187 00:56:37,920 --> 00:56:32,050 the wrapped instrument which observed 1188 00:56:41,790 --> 00:56:37,930 these new radiation belts many of us who 1189 00:56:44,520 --> 00:56:41,800 are also part of a older satellite 1190 00:56:47,370 --> 00:56:44,530 mission called Sam packs now Sam packs 1191 00:56:51,300 --> 00:56:47,380 was the very first so-called small 1192 00:56:53,990 --> 00:56:51,310 explorers was launched in 92 and it was 1193 00:56:57,480 --> 00:56:54,000 expected to last nearly three years 1194 00:57:00,630 --> 00:56:57,490 however it lasted twenty years and it 1195 00:57:05,280 --> 00:57:00,640 was just about to come down late 1196 00:57:09,510 --> 00:57:05,290 November last year just a few months 1197 00:57:12,930 --> 00:57:09,520 after RB or Van Allen probes were 1198 00:57:17,660 --> 00:57:12,940 launched so we wanted to increase our 1199 00:57:20,040 --> 00:57:17,670 scientific return by making 1200 00:57:22,710 --> 00:57:20,050 simultaneous measurements while sand 1201 00:57:25,020 --> 00:57:22,720 packs was what we call in a low Earth 1202 00:57:28,350 --> 00:57:25,030 orbit it was close to the Earth's 1203 00:57:30,840 --> 00:57:28,360 surface and Van Allen probes are in an 1204 00:57:33,320 --> 00:57:30,850 equatorial orbit which is at a very high 1205 00:57:39,060 --> 00:57:33,330 altitude goes all the way to six times 1206 00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:39,070 radii so we decided to turn our 1207 00:57:47,190 --> 00:57:42,490 instrument on on day three instead of 1208 00:57:49,950 --> 00:57:47,200 day 30 and hoping to get some new 1209 00:57:53,430 --> 00:57:49,960 science by conjunction studies as we 1210 00:57:56,250 --> 00:57:53,440 call them with this other low-flying 1211 00:57:59,010 --> 00:57:56,260 satellite and by the way we are still 1212 00:58:00,870 --> 00:57:59,020 exploring that option we are gathering 1213 00:58:02,550 --> 00:58:00,880 we are analyzing the final data 1214 00:58:05,250 --> 00:58:02,560 collected by Centex 1215 00:58:09,270 --> 00:58:05,260 so that was the reason why we turned on 1216 00:58:13,680 --> 00:58:09,280 and then as it happened we were we got 1217 00:58:17,370 --> 00:58:13,690 lucky and the Sun was most benevolent to 1218 00:58:20,600 --> 00:58:17,380 us and provided us with this event which 1219 00:58:29,130 --> 00:58:20,610 turned out to be a completely unexpected 1220 00:58:31,530 --> 00:58:29,140 but a very exciting surprise well we are 1221 00:58:33,660 --> 00:58:31,540 just about up with our hour today I want 1222 00:58:35,820 --> 00:58:33,670 to thank everyone for being here thanks 1223 00:58:38,670 --> 00:58:35,830 everyone for watching and thank you to 1224 00:58:41,340 --> 00:58:38,680 all the people who participated Brian 1225 00:58:43,290 --> 00:58:41,350 vast egg from the Washington Post Alex 1226 00:58:46,380 --> 00:58:43,300 Young and Dave Stieb egg and tree 1227 00:58:51,660 --> 00:58:46,390 conical from Goddard from NASA Goddard 1228 00:58:55,200 --> 00:58:51,670 and Sasha from Johns Hopkins APL has 1229 00:58:58,170 --> 00:58:55,210 been a great discussion I this will live 1230 00:59:01,200 --> 00:58:58,180 on YouTube afterwards so if you enjoyed 1231 00:59:04,380 --> 00:59:01,210 watching us today feel free to send the 1232 00:59:05,660 --> 00:59:04,390 link to all of your friends and of 1233 00:59:10,290 --> 00:59:05,670 course you can watch it again and again 1234 00:59:13,470 --> 00:59:10,300 as well for more information in the 1235 00:59:18,540 --> 00:59:13,480 future on heliophysics research at NASA 1236 00:59:21,900 --> 00:59:18,550 you may go to nasa.gov slash Sun Earth 1237 00:59:24,750 --> 00:59:21,910 that's one word sun earth and a reminder 1238 00:59:29,670 --> 00:59:24,760 that youtube link will be available at 1239 00:59:30,270 --> 00:59:29,680 YouTube / NASA Explorer one word we've 1240 00:59:32,550 --> 00:59:30,280 had 1241 00:59:35,760 --> 00:59:32,560 great time with you all today thanks for 1242 00:59:37,890 --> 00:59:35,770 sharing in a new media attempt with us